I sit and read day in and day out how comments are made by us, as spectators on various blogs etc, even reading articles by so called Sports Journalists on other sites.
We all have points of view which are our god given right, at the same time we should not take notice of racist or trouble maker posts made as they have other agenda’s and are not posting for the sake of a wonderful sport but self fulfilment.
I was thinking, as I read through Articles and Comments made on that thread, firstly seeing the article and shaking my head in amazement at the lack of rugby knowledge from this so called professional journalist.
Now, when one judges a player and a team one must look at a lot of contributing factors that should be taken into account, before insulting and throwing all these silly comments into the air without truly understanding the game:
1) TEAM SELECTION
2) GAME PLAN
3) CONDITIONS
4) COMBINATIONS
5) STRENGTHS AND WEAKNESSES OF PLAYERS
6) PRACTICE AS A UNIT
7) A PLAYERS ABILLITY TO HANDLE PRESSURE
8) FORM OF PLAYERS
9) HEALTH, FITNESS AND CONDITIONING
Were all these adhered to? I don’t think so.
The list goes on, but I want to explain how one should look at a team and then at a player, and how one should assess a player. There are many examples one can use but I thought to explain one or 2 to try show perspective to last night’s poor showing by the Bokke.
People have the habit of blaming players and results without truly understanding the role of that player, or function that he or the team or the scrum has.
“I took the 3 loose forwards and looked at their functions as an individual and a unit”
Let’s look at the different aspects and functions of a loose forward!
1) Scrumming
2) All forms of defence
3) Fetching and winning turn over ball
4) Lineout’s and support
5) Rucks and Mauls
6) Ball carrying and linking between backs and forwards
Now if one takes and analyses each position and each player in the same way one would see very different Articles written by Sports Journalists, as well as more sane comments made by followers of the game.
Ashley Johnstone, I felt was not as good as people thought for the following reasons, but in saying that he was still one of the better players for the Springboks on the field:
Did he defend well? No.
Did he scrum well? No.
Did he fetch and win any turnovers? No, but in saying that no balls could be turned over because of the officiating, and the less said about that the better.
Numbers 4, 5 & 6 he did well.
Dewald Potgieter
Numbers 4, 5 and 6 he did well.
Number 1 he was poor.
Number 3, nobody in the Bokke won turn over ball.
Number 2 he defended very well but also did miss a few tackles, with him once or twice running past the defensive lines, thus leaving gaps.
Jean Deysel
Numbers 1,2,4,5 and 6 he did well, as one could actually see him pushing in the scrums behind Jannie DuPlessis. He made yards when driving with ball and brought grunt to the pack (as one could clearly see when the NO 19 of the Tigers, in an attempt at tackling Deysel straight from the front, landed firmly on his behind).
He did lose a ball whilst carrying a ball up, but to be honest with no support he had no chance, and it happened to quite a few players on the evening.
Number 3 as I said, no player was able to perform this function because of officiating.
And its for this reason I say Deysel was the best loose forward, and I refrained from mentioning young Raubenheimer as he should not have been there, the poor youngster was totally out of his depth and was clearly shell shocked.
So what became very evident last night was the lack of “MATCH PRACTICE AND GAME PLANNING FOR THIS GAME”
If one judged the players like this and fairly, one would see a game in a very different light, and also see a player in a different way. When one then breaks up the team into its sections one sees a different picture, and might not throw so many spanners at the players.
There was so little planning which went into this game and it showed. Yes the scrums were poor, but if you analysed the whole pack, not only the front row, one would see a totally different picture. I doubt any subsitute front row would have been better if the same conditions existed and only the front 3 pushed, for example.
At halftime a very good analysis by SuperSport showed our scrums, and why they were ineffective, it showed how the locks and loose forwards exhibited bad body positions during scrum time, and how the loose forwards were not even pushing and just hanging on the fringes.
I know who and what I blame and what would turn around last night’s catastrophe. One thing I know is that if the right players for the conditions are not chosen we are in trouble, and we need better planning for these midweek games or more sadness will surely follow.
So who is to blame, your thoughts?
Middag almal
yes even you GBS hehehe 😆
to me if the right players for the conditions up north and also offciating are not chosen we will be in trouble
it is clear that even brussow will struggle up north
there you want hard men tough men that give more grunt
To me the following bok team should have been chosen for the conditons up north,
The way games are officiated up north is not the same as down in the south, also teams dont know about fetching , even Brussow last night would have been unsuccesful as teams up north ruck and maul over the ball and seal it going to ground
15 Kirschner ( should have been F Steyn)
14 JPP
13 Fourie
12 WO
11 Habana
10 M Steyn
09 Dupreez
08 Alberts
07 Deysel
06 Schalk
05 matfield
04 Bakkies
03 Smitty
02 Bismark
01 Beast or Wian Dupreez
16 Strauss
17 Dupreez
18 Roussow
19 brussow
20 Adi
21 Ruan
22 Mapoe
of course had players like BJ been available to play one could have had Smitty to start at 2 and BJ at 3 , with Smitty later on moving to 3 and Bismark coming on from the bench
I agree, yet I differ… let me explain.
Loosies have to be a balanced combo (damn, I’ve said this a lot), 3 differing roles for 3 differing players.
Brussouw at 6 is a must… he is the out-and-out fetcher, whether here or up North… remember the pitches in NZ are very similar to up North.
At Blindside (No 7), Either Schalla, Vermeulen, Dewalt Potgieter or Deysel are good options… demon tacklers who carry the ball up strongly.
At No 8…. the man with hands of gold who is a strike runner and who is a valuable link between forwards and backs. In the absense of Spies, there should have been an Alberts or a Vermeulen or a Dewalt Potgieter… or lastly, a Kanko. Ashley Johnson can feel satisfied that he has made his mark, I expect a lot from him in future.
When a good loosie combo is picked, they make each other’s roles sooooooooooooo much easier…
Regarding the front row, yes they need to be replaced, they were terrible, but a front row is only as good as the locks who keeps them going forward, in this respect Bekker fails dismally…. the grunt of Sykes or Van Zyl or the 2 Cheetahs were needed… not Bekker and certainly not the lightweight Hargreaves.
At halfbacks one needs 2 generals with sublime tactical nous…. neither Adams or Ruan had this ability, in fact they complicated matters for a Bokke forward pack who was already being shunted backwards.
The on-field captain should have the ability to gel the players, get them all to shove in the scrums… in this respect Chilli was hugely inadequate… Wynand is no captain… Dewalt Potgieter should have been captain from word go….
Oh, and probably the worst of all, last night’s team was never picked with combinations in mind…. no front row or front 5 who are used to each other, no loosie combo who instictively would have known where his fellow loosie buddies would be, no halfback pairing who knew each other’s socks from the inside out, no centre pairing who have played in tandum…. no back 3 who have played together.
Bad planning, bad selections…. no hiding that fact.
Folks, lets be honest. The writing has been on the wall for the last few tests, and was pretty evident to see in the CC. If your scrum is being man shamed then the loosies and backline look like shit.
I fear the test next week. The Frogs will pick to props than CAN scrum, the same front row that was murdered by the Cheetahs will crumble and it will negate the rest of the team.
Gurthro, Jannie, Beast and [sadly] Smit are not Bok quality props. Heinke hasn’t played in 8 months so he was a stuipid choice even as a looshead.
The hookers chosen are perhaps choced 7 and 8 in SA. Why choose a player who is a limpimg sick note and can’t make the starting 15 at his province and his deputy as Boks?
It is a shambles.
Die mense gaan so oor bj aan ma nou die dag kyk ek n game van ulster en raai wie word toe 6 keer in daai game gestraf hy is nie so hot nie.cj is ma die antw. wian smit cj gelock deur bakkies en vic problem solved
6 hoor, hoor.
Good Article and thought provoking. But consider what the Tigers coach said afterwards.
“Rugby can get quite scientific in its analysis these days.
“Sometimes you just need 15 blokes to come here and roll their sleeves up – and that’s what we did.”
For all the debate on each players performance the Boks simply were not as “up for it” as the Tigers were and to me that is the major reason why SA lost. If SA had won who will remember it a year from now ? Every Leicester player realised they had an opportunity to achieve a win against the World Champs and they wanted it more than we did.
I agree the players are not entirely to blame and the whole concept of a development group etc is a bad idea. I join you in placing some blame at the feet of others but when the whistle goes the players have to take responsibility.
The ref was a plonker but conditions were not that bad – cool and only a little damp, it wasn’t the mud bath UK pitches can be during the 6 nations. There has been very little rain here for 3 months so the arguement about Northern Hemisphere conditions and players isnt that relevant – against Ireland in 3 weeks maybe yes but not last night.
Also we shouldnt ever analise a player (3rd paragraph from bottom)- and definitely not the whole pack. It might not be legal. They wouldnt mind, I’m sure, if they were analysed.
Old Sharky-me-mate, thanks but no thanks for your biased review of where it all began. Like our friend the Nasty Booter you too seem delusional about what happens when the opposition wheels the scrum clockwise. Playing north to south and with the scrum on the western side of a longditudinal line through the centerspot, as was the case in the example shown, with the scrum having wheeled clockwise, it is a clear sign that if anything, it is the 7 flanker that wasn’t pushing in the scrum. If the 6 keeps pushing the scrum will eventually wheel 360 degrees. As Owen tried to explain, it is far better for the 6 to prepare and position himself to defend, rather than to expend energy unnecessarily.
“On the other hand, one way or another”, it is clear that the collective scrumming effort was not anywhere near what it needs to be to get a well-timed simultaneous,- including the loosies, hit on the opponents, but in the example shown by Naas the horse had already bolted, so to say Dewald’s scrumming was bad is a little rich. And funny thing, the scrum kept on screwing exactly the same when Deysel came on so somuch for that theory of yours.
As far as your comparison of their defensive efforts, Pottie put in twice the number of tackles as Deysel in the time Deysel was on. He just doesn’t have the same defensive workrate to even be mentioned in the same breath.
As for ball-in-hand abilities, Deysel was taken two to three yards backwards in the first tackle on him and from then on it was more of the same, except for once when he bounced a defender off anf gained maximum 5 meters. In the carry, Pottie also battled to break through due to excellent defense by the Tigers. It had nothing to do with size or weight, which in my book is an overrated yardstick in any case. In this respect, if Pottie is too light or small, then Ashley Johnson is as well, and he made plenty yards in the carry which you yourself give him credit for as well. Difference was, he came from the back from depth for most of his runs, while with the flat defensive line of the Tigers Pottie and Deysel got man and ball simultaneously.
I agree with GBS we lacked combinations in a match like that, and Pottie should have been the starting captain. That much at least is now clear. As for the rest, only time will tell.
#Mieliepapmike
I agree wholeheartedly with you, and for that matter, with the Tigers Coach. They werehungrier than us, end of story, although I also believe that he will be big enough to admit that in those last few minutes they were hanging on for dear life, so there is a modicum of solace in that. Things can only get better from here on.
I don’t want to be a drol, bit I am gonna put one more reason out there that could have possibly led to the demise of the SA XV on Friday.
How many Bulls and Sharks players made up the team?
I am by no means saying that I am against ANY Sharks or Bulls player representing South Africa. To the contrary. But it seems to me that the selectors are somehow fixated on picking players only from the Bulls and Sharks since the team/franchise is so good.
Would it have been possible to consider Chavanga instead of Ndugane. imagine Nokwe and Chavanga on the wings. Suppose you cant, because they will be there and then gone.
Would it have hurt to consider Vermaak/Pretorius/Duvenhage/Pienaar at 9 other than Adams. Even the 2nd and 3rd rated hookers from the Bulls gets picked above the 1st rated hooker from WP and Cheetahs, both teams having made it through to the semi-finals of the CC, and both great Hookers. Or what about the starting props of the Cheetahs and WP. Steenkamp KUKKED of many times this year already. and Jannie, as good as he is, does not even get a 1st place at the Sharks, and has not been outstanding lately. Apparently the Bok pack got chowed like wilsons toffee’s. But I mean come on. Chilli, Jannie, Danie en sometimes Ashly are 2nd string players at their unions. And what about the combos?????? a Cheetah, Shark and Bull that has never played together before. How about playing Danie in the loosies. At least him and Potgieter have played together before.
My question is just this. Would it not have been better to just fly over the whole Cheetah or WP team and play them, rather than a mix of guys who has (1) not played together as a team at all, (2) been picked as 2nd and 3rd stringers from their own unions and (3) have not been playing that much this year??? The best players from the Sharks and Bulls are the Best in the world. But as the CC log showed us, the second stringers from the bulls are not as good as their senior counter parts. The teams place in the semis was in doubt right before the arrival of their stars. Why then still pick 5 of them, based on, what I presume, is the reputation that proceeds them largely due to their seniors??? Could it be that SARU is so drunk with the success of the team, they believe any player from that union, is better than a any player form another Union?
Are the selectors biased? Am I raising valid questions?
This is not the only selection flaw, but I think there is something to be read in it.
Before people start chowing me like a toffee, let me make a few things clear…
Yes, I do hate the Bulls.
No, I have no problem if any player from that Union, or any other than WP represents the Boks, as long as we win.
Yes, i do realise that there were other flaws in the selection process. Favorites, qoutas, maybe, ect.
All I am saying is that I think the administrators could not step back for one second and look not be taken in by the success of the team, but rather got caught up in the frenzy.
11 – GG
Selections what cost us. W.du Preez, A. Strauss, WP. Nel front row would never have been shafted like that. With Sykes, Bekker at their backs. Then the loosies should have been the same that played for the E. Boks. Potgieter, Deysel, Vermeulen or Alberts. With that tight five and the loosies we would never have been pushed about in the scrum.
Ruan should not play FH either. Does not want too. Maybe scrummie. I personally would have had Stegmann from the Bulls at 9. The Cheetahs FH at FH. Nokwe at 11 or even Mvovo from the Sharks. Mapoe at 14 and Rose was fine at FB. Or even J. Pietersen at FB. With that team we would never ever have lost.
We only lost by 5 with our C team there. Should always select the best. We the supporters too have our pride. No excuse to select not the best to tour. Missed out trying out some of our 2nd best there.
13 – Missed out the centres there. WO and Adi. I don’t think Adi is up to the 1st team anymore. Should still select JdV at inside centre even if he is playing at Munster now and F. Steyn should still have been selected to play FB even though he is playing at Metro. Need to play our very best Test side or Dirt Trackers. So maybe then Zane for FB in the Dirt Trackers if FS could have been selected for the test side. Then Rose did play well but then in the next game he may not.
Puma. Agree with the front row, locks and loosies. A very good pack that should start playing these kinda games together to get the ball rolling for a possible take over after 2011.
In th backs there are more options than just Pienaar and Rose… Divvy
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