Heyneke Meyer
We have received a request by a reader and newly registered blogger here on Rugby-Talk.com, Helgaard, to place an ARTICLE here on Rugby-Talk, containing an OPEN LETTER by him to SA Rugby, all supporters and interested parties as well as decision-makers in our country.
The topic of the Letter, follows the trend and main topic of discussion amongst Springbok supporters, namely whether Heyneke Meyer should stay on as coach, or whether he should go.
In his well-worded and well-reasoned letter, Helgaard supports the “Heyneke Must Fall” stance on the matter, and seeing as Rugby-Talk.com is “By the people, for the people” we gladly place relevant and requested reader content here on Rugby-Talk.com… once if conforms to the necessary literary requirements, of course. I wish more readers would act like Helgaard and send me their contributions, as it could lead to Rugby-Talk.com really becoming the official voice of the marginalized supporter out there and depicting the views of the average rugby supporter and not for supporters to be boxed in by the normal way media steers things to suit their own agendas.
Helgaard’s views are his own and does not necessarily reflect the views of this publication.
Without further a do… here is Helgaard’s Letter in it’s entirity:
WHY HEYNEKE MUST FALL…
Background to the article
As a dedicated Springbok supporter, I watched my fair share of the 48 games played at the Rugby World Cup 2015, including the 7 Tests in which the Springboks featured. I also watched all of the other 40 Tests played since Heyneke Meyer took over as the Springbok coach.
I have been inspired by the comments that I have heard from astute observers of the game and the SuperSport panel during the Rugby World Cup and what I have read from respected journalists about the state of Springbok rugby. I feel strongly that the voiceless supporters of the Springboks should be able to communicate their opinions, because this wonderful game doesn’t belong to SARU alone. It belongs to all those who have faithfully supported our team over all these years. For these reasons I have decided to make a contribution by writing my views on why “Heyneke must fall!!”
I was also encouraged by the contributions of former Springboks, like Stefan Terblanche in an article in the Mercury and Wynand Claassen and Divan Serfontein in the Sunday Times. They all came to the same conclusions that Heyneke’s game plan and stereotyped playing style, with its inherent inadequacies, won’t take the Springboks to the next level.
It is well known that SARU pays scant attention to the views of the supporters, treating them as consumers rather than as stakeholders and as it is very difficult to communicate constructively with SARU and for this reason you need to resort to different ways of getting your views across. It has become a malaise in our country that the aggrieved consumers have to revert to alternative methods of getting their views across.
I have prepared my contribution to the debate, as supporters are increasingly pleading for constructive change so that South Africa can again emerge as a proud rugby-playing country. I acknowledge that getting rid of Heyneke is only one part of the solution, as there has to be structural changes in the way we approach and play the game. Yet I still believe that we have to be saved from what Heyneke stands for.
How should we judge Heyneke?
I think it is fair to say that every coach should be fairly judged on his tenure in charge of the Springbok team and after his first Rugby World Cup. The time has arrived to judge Heyneke and I have outlined some of the reasons why it would be ill advised to extend his contract.
Consider the following:
Some background
1. There is a massive gap between the All Blacks and the rest of the world in the way that they approach and play the game.
2. The clear signals are there that if the rugby system in South Africa doesn’t adapt dramatically, the Boks will keep on losing ground and won’t be good enough to compete against countries like New Zealand or Australia. This is based on the form that they showed during the Rugby World Cup. It is, however, relevant and fair to ask what role the coach has played in the demise of Springboks rugby?
3. Heyneke sometimes distorts facts so that his coaching efforts can be viewed in a more positive light. Consider just some of the many misleading statements that he has made:
- On arriving back in South Africa after the Rugby World Cup, he mentioned that the only difference between the Boks and the All Blacks was Dan Carter’s drop goal. This is a gross distortion and a misleading claim. It doesn’t acknowledge the undeniable fact that the Boks were outplayed by the All Blacks in most facets of the game.
- Heyneke also claimed that 80% to 90% of the current players would be available for the 2019 Rugby World Cup. I doubt whether more than 70% will be available.
Heyneke’s record
4. Heyneke has only won 1 out of 8 games against the All Blacks and I can’t imagine that many international coaches would have survived such a record? It gets worse when you consider that:
- He hasn’t won a single Rugby Championship (Four Nations) and in 2015 he took the Boks to an all-time low by not winning one game in The Rugby Championship.
- During the End-Of-Year tour in 2014 he lost to both Ireland and Wales. Wales at that stage had only beaten the Boks once in 109 years of competing;
- This was followed by our first-ever losses against the Argentinian Pumas and Japan.
5. Wynand and Divan posed the question what fate would have befallen Steve Hansen, the All Black coach, if his team lost against Argentina and then losing to Japan at the Rugby World Cup and returned home with only a bronze medal as a conciliation price?
Question marks about Heyneke’s game plan as an international coach
6. Heyneke has been slow to adapt to the changing playing environment in the world and when under pressure his default position is to revert to his conservative playing style.
7. As Wynand and Divan have pointed out, he is a pattern rugby coach instead of coaching individual skills. He is obsessed with size and power. His archaic style doesn’t work, but he is persisting with it while the rest of the world has moved on to playing total 15-man rugby. As a consequence all other countries know exactly what the Springboks will do and plan accordingly.
8. During the last year he has not impressed as a technically capable coach. He seems reluctant to experiment with new ideas. During the Rugby World Cup he was out-smarted a few times by other coaches. Consider the following:
- Early in 2015, the Argentinians surprised the Boks with their ball in hand approach and outplayed them with their fast-paced game;
- The Japanese were well prepared against the Boks and they anticipated virtually every move that that the Boks used against them. The Boks were also caught flat-footed when Japan scored the last try. Eddie Jones, their coach, remarked that they knew exactly what the Springboks would do and they were prepared for it;
- In the semifinal, the All Blacks kept putting kicks in behind the Boks and turning them around. They beat the Boks by stealing 4 lineouts, missing only 3 tackles out of 86, (Boks lost 20 out of 151) and they won more gain line collisions.
9. Nic Mallet has commented that Heyneke game plan is based on No 9 controlling the game and deciding to whom the ball should be passed. Most other teams allow their No 10 to control the game as they are in a far better position to pick the runners that could break the advantage line.
The big problem – Lack of skills and what has Heyneke done about it?
10. During Heyneke’s tenure there has been very little improvement in the skill levels of the Boks and one must question whether this was treated as a priority area. In 2015, the Boks were characterised by poor aerial skills, they often used poor exit strategies and the line kicking by the two pivotal players (Pollard and Le Roux) were unacceptable. These skills were below international standard and need to be fixed if the Boks want to make progress.
11. In the Sunday Times of 1 November, Heyneke is quoted as saying in defence of his game plan that there was “only one way for the Boks to play”, because the team did not have the necessary skills to do it differently. This is an astounding statement as by implication he is saying that the Boks don’t possess the ability to improve their skills. They, however, had the skills to adapt to his pattern style of playing? That is probably the crux of where Heyneke has failed as a coach. He has put the Springboks back a further 4 years and it is a dreadful thought that we might have to endure him for another 4 years.
12. Consider how the All Blacks reacted after 2009, when they lost 3 times against the Springboks. Collectively they improved their aerial skills, strengthened their back three so that they could add another attacking option by running from deep.
13. A weakness over the years has been that Bok runners often die with the ball without attempting to find support players. Damian de Allende and Jesse Kriel are both players who have the ability to break the advantage line, but they often fail to pass the ball to a linking player. These are basic things that any coach has the ability to improve, but Heyneke has failed in this regard.
14. Heyneke places inordinate reliance on players and officials that are close to him, rather than questioning what is the best is for the Springboks.
Transformation Record
Heyneke’s transformation record has been described as woeful. Under pressure he took 9 Black players out of 31 to the Rugby World Cup. Only Bryan Habana, JP Pietersen, Beast Mtawarira and Damian de Allende got regular game time. Trevor Nyakane was involved in every game, but as part of the bench. Lwazi Mvovo played two-and-half games while Siya Kolisi and Rudy Page only appeared twice off the bench.
I think Heyneke missed a golden opportunity to bring some more and talented players into the Springbok frame. By doing that, he would create role models for more than 90% of South Africa’s population who are ‘black’, to increase our current pool of rugby players significantly. There will continue to be pressure on the Springboks to increase the quotas as the new Transformation Charter has been presented to the Government and it is cast in stone. There will have to be a concerted effort to bring more Black players into the system. Is Heyneke the man who will achieve this?
Has Heyneke enhanced the standing of the Boks in world terms?
Perhaps we were given a clear message on how the state of Springbok rugby is perceived by the international community when the Springboks weren’t nominated for any of the awards presented at the conclusion of the Rugby World Cup. The only South African in the awards was, Werner Kok, who was chosen as the best Sevens player in 2015.
During the last year the standing of the Springboks in the rugby playing community has declined and South Africa is no longer the feared rugby playing country we once were. During the Rugby World Cup a number of countries like Wales and Scotland seriously rated their chances of beating the Boks. It will be the case in the future because of our predictable game plan and if our tactics remain the same.
Heyneke also comes across on TV as not being in control of his own emotions. One can only wonder what persona he presents when dealing with his players in a playing field or team room environment.
Wynand and Divan asked the question: “Can SA rugby afford to have someone who behaves like a maniac in the coaching enclosure, wearing his Springbok blazer, in the eyes of the whole world on television?” My allied question is whether a coach who so consistently loses his cool can be reasonably expected to take a professional side to the next level?
How we can move forward?
A lot needs to change in South African rugby for the Springboks to be successful at the next Rugby World Cup. The first acknowledgment has to be that there are structural problems with the way we play rugby which needs to be addressed at national level. The coach is not the only person to blame, but you need to put a coaching structure in place that can best deal with the structural deficiencies.
Our problems cannot be fixed in the short term and it will take the concerted effort and commitment of the rugby community to do so. There has consistently been talk about this and it can be done and for once the lead must come from the top and SARU must show the commitment to making the tough decisions. The need to contract the Springboks players on a national rather than on a provincial basis, Central Contracting, has been consistent topic of discussion. This way their progress and workload can be properly planned without a fair percentage of the Springboks plying their trade overseas.
The problems can only be fixed if there is an acceptance that the Boks won’t be good enough unless our rugby system changes. My overwhelming impression after putting these comments together is that the Springboks will struggle to show meaningful improvement if the current coaching staff remains. Before any remedial action can commence “Heyneke must fall.”
Welcome Helgaard.
‘Tis well considered & written.
You could (if you wish) resign your day job, mate. 🙂
And here is the succinct opinion of another blogger (Baylion) as posted on another rugby site:
“I’m all for consistency but why start by keeping the worst coach? A coach who appointed inexperienced and unqualified assistant coaches, not one of them capable of coaching a provincial team let alone take over as Bok coach, now or even in another four years.
The assistants of the Bok coach who take us forward, whether Meyer or someone else, must be vetted for their qualifications. This is where the big difference between the Meyer regime and those of PdV and JW lies and also between the current Bok management and those of the All Blacks and the Wallabies.
Hansen has qualified Super Rugby and international coaches as his assistants and consultants, so too Cheika and so did Graham Henry. Meyer has the Bulls CEO’s son, with no coaching experience, and a Varsity Cup backline coach as his assistants.”
Helgaard, thank you for your contribution, it is appreciated!
My views on the matter is well documented by now.
I do not see Heyneke Meyer alone at fault, I see it as one of the symptoms of the broader problems in South African rugby.
If we axe Heyneke and nothing else is done to fix the ails, we will be at this junction again, with everybody up in arms, the next time the Springboks lose or the next time a Rugby World Cup comes and goes.
I think MacroBull summed it up perfectly when he said we tend to think reactively in stead of acting in a responsible pro-active way.
So, whereas we are not happy with Heyneke Meyer, surely we should also consider what comes AFTER he is sacked… and that is where I think we are at our weakest. The suitable candidates to replace Heyneke are not exactly lining up in a queue on SARU’s pavement in Cape Town, and if you exclude Foreign Coaches, that queue gets even dramatically shorter.
We are in a state of flux here, with no clear successor to appoint.
We are also entering a totally NEW ERA in Super Rugby, with almost all of the South African Super Rugby coaches being totally new appointments, with new ideas and yet untested success ratios.
Is it not exactly now the right time to impliment a unique South African way of playing, a new style and balanced approach, to place all SA’s Super Rugby franchises on the same page and thus the ideal time to provide a better and more complete type of player to the national coach, as they come off Super Rugby in June… a fitter and better-conditioned product, players with improved skillsets, with their minds and muscle memory already tuned to this new balanced game approach?
Is it not now exactly the right time to make a call towards excluding overseas-based players from qualifying to play for the Springboks, without playing in Super Rugby or a South African domestic competition?
Is it not the perfect opportunity to move towards Central Contracting?
Is this not the opportune moment to institute a clear succession plan for the position as Springbok head coach and Assistant Coaches?
I guess the fair question to ask is whether SARU has the combined IQ and EQ to see this broader picture and to effectively do something about it!
Helgaard also asked me to provide him with E-Mail contact particulars of SARU so that he can send this Letter on to them, and my response was: “Here it is, but don’t be surprised if it just gets blocked and swept under the rug by Andy Kalkoen (Colquhoun), GM of Corporate Affairs”.
My response further was that SARU sees the supporter as a consumer of the game and not a Stakeholder in the game in South Africa (I see he included it in his last revision of his letter)… and that needs a dramatic change as well. These individuals at SARU believe they ARE RUGBY IN SA and not that they are merely CUSTODIANS OF RUGBY IN SOUTH AFRICA, with a huge responsibility on their shoulders, to set things straight.
Same applies to Heyneke, he is a mere custodian coach… and his own conservatism, preferential treatment of players, over loyaly & stubornness needs to go out the window, if rugby in SA is to succeed!
I would like to hear Helgaard’s suggestions for an alternative Head Coach for the Springboks… one that would be available AND better than Heyneke Meyer, one who has not burnt his bridges with SARU.
My viewpoint is that a Powerhouse of World Rugby should NEVER, EVER appoint a foreign coach… and the South African political and transformational landscape makes this stance of mine just more pertinent.
Personally, I want to see what Super Rugby holds for 2016 in South Africa, before another Springbok Head Coach is appointed, so I would like to see Heyneke Meyer continue in the role in the changing landscape, for 2 years or so, till a suitable replacement can be groomed and all the other critical factors put in place. That will give a clear 2 years before the next Rugby World Cup, sufficient time to appoint a new Head Coach and give him the opportunity to turn things around, should Heyneke not adapt and improve.
Is THAT asking too much?
I see Wynand Claassen suggests that Allister Coetzee or Johan Ackermann would be viable replacements for Heyneke’s Head Coaching position.
I think he is short-sighted and bordering on delusional.
Firstly, Allister Coetzee is not exactly known for any attacking or complete rugby, now is he! Sure, the WP and Stormers defence under Allister was sharp as razors, but there was no impetus on attack, running into space or running exciting lines… and one could never consider his teams playing well-balanced rugby. Apart from that, he is in a newly appointed position in Japan (could have an exit clause in his contract there).
Secondly, if we remember back to 2007, Allister’s failings at the Springboks as Assistant Coach under Jake White had to be remedied by the late appointment of Eddie Jones as consultant.
Thirdly, Johan Ackermann might be a viable option in a couple of years, but not NOW. The Emirates Lions first need to carry their exciting and well-balanced game approach through to Super Rugby successfully before I consider him a total success. He might be well on his way to doing just that… give him the time to do so!
Like so many others, Wynand Claassen jumped on the band wagon to have Heyneke ousted (for his specifically suspect reasons, already detailed elsewhere), before thinking through what comes AFTER Heyneke Meyer.
Let’s contend for a while that Allister Coetzee and / or Johan Ackermann are better than Heyneke Meyer right now…. the nagging question then still remains if either one of them is the “Final Solution”? Do we appoint somebody now as a caretaker or are we planning for continuity and taking the Springboks all the way?
If we are considering a “Final Solution”, would it not be prudent to wait till that candidate reveals himself?
Heard a funny Afrikaans joke about the Heyneke Must Fall campaign.
Mense vra nou wat kom eerste, die Hoender of die Meyer?
Getting rid of HM will be like treating the symptom and not the cause.
Let me put on record, I’m no Meyer fan, but I reiterate that I cannot for 1 minute believe that ANY coach, at any level will pick a team and utilise a game plan that HE does not believe will win a particular game.
While the Bok performances, and by association, Meyer’s record are what we as the public see on a Saturday afternoon out on the field, the truth is that this is but the tip of the iceberg.
SA Rugby is very, very ill.
Summarily changing the head coach and his support team may well bring immediate short term joy in terms of wins, but in reality it will be nothing more than a “dead cat bounce”. (Google it)
SA Rugby needs to go back to basics, educate EVERYONE involved from the U/6 coaches up, and change the playing philosophy of the country.
There is no quick fix. It needs to be done over the course of a generation.
Unfortunately, I don’t believe that SARU give a tinkers’ cuss what we as paying spectators, the likes of Serfontein and Claasens as “old” Bokke, or even the current players feel.
We need only look at their track record for confirmation of that.
Good luck to all involved.
It’s only about 1400 days until RWC 2019 in Japan gets going.
If you wish to evaluate an entity, being it a business or anything else, evaluate its vision and mission.
In South Africa all sports organisations are forced by the Government that their missions and visions are based on transformation, and not excellency.
The correct place to start is is for the Government to stop interfering with sport organisations. Then they can based their visions and missions on excellency.
What Wynand Claasen and his pals try to do is to cut off the tail of the cat.
Untill such time it will become worst.
7 @ dWeePer:
Or in this case, the tail of the Springbok bok!
Hahaha
Yeah, the solution is complex, it’s not just about firing 1 individual!
Talking about International coaches, I heard on the radio in the car just now that Stuart Lancaster , England coach, has stepped down, resigned.
@ Angostura:
Thanks for the kind words particularly seeing that this is my first blog. I think Heyneke will attract a lot of comment over the next month and my wish is that SARU would take this matter seriously and acknowledge that they have to lead with a new strategy to get our rugby out of this quagmire that it finds itself. it is in. I cannot see Heyneke being part of that strategy.
Helgaard
@ Angostura:
I am in agreement with everything that you have said. Because of space concerns I didn’t raise the experience of Heyneke’s support staff and SARU must share the blame for allowing him to pick that combination. If we continue with that combination we, at some stage in the future, would be faced with the same dilemma and we would have lost another 4 years to take drastic action to implement change. We need an experienced coaching team and for the first time in our history it might have to come from another country? Isn’t SA, England and NZ the only countries that have never had an foreign coach?
Helgaard
Why have some coaches had success under the same SARU?
The matter of selection and coaching comes down to the head coach, he decides which players he wants to play the game plan he wants them to play.
That is where Heyneke failed.
I have read lots of comments that could be used as excuses for the poor play of the Boks, and yes, some are valid, but how does that excuse the coach?
Players are unfit when they reach the Bok camp….sorry, but call me old fashioned or ignorant, but in my book if you want to call yourself a professional rugby player, then you as player should damn we’ll be fit enough to play a game of rugby that lasts for 80 minutes, finish en klaar.
No excuses about franchise coaches and fitness coaches.
Richie McCaw is 34 years old and for the last decade plus he has been the fittest player in the All Black side…not because Hansen or Todd Blackadder makes him fit, but because he wants to be the fittest player.
If the head coach of the Boks want to cry about players not being fit enough, grow some balls and pick players that are professional enough to have the correct standard of fitness.
No one forced him to pick unfit and injured players, he wanted them to play and fit into his 2007 school rugby plan.
It’s not rocket science, if a player can’t play for 80 minutes he is not a professional and should not be rewarded with any caps.
If we are still going to lose, because of SARU and players not being skillful etc, then they can pick any other coach to have a go, but not reward one who already proved himself to be a failure.
grootblousmile wrote:
An honorable coach who admitted he failed and was already contracted till 2019 but knows his limitations…..unlike you know who who can’t wait to plod along for another 4 years and pocket an additional 20 Million in the process
@ grootblousmile:
Thank you Grootblousmile and you have raised some valid points and we are in agreement that are broader problems that need to be resolved and that it wouldn’t necessarily be resolved by just changing the coach. The two actions need to implemented concurrently so that you give the new coach as much time as possible to work with a new crop of players that will go to the next RWC. Bear in mind that there are likely to be about 10 players that would retire before the next RWC and of the 21 remaining players there would only be 7 black players. As I understand the Transformation Charter that would apply going forward, the coach would have to groom, at least, another 8 or 9 black players that would become part of the Springbok training squad.
I think we would have to include a NZ coach in the next coaching panel and it needs to be a combination with some South African coaches. The names that come to mind are:
1) John Plumtree 2)will apply me mind to suitable coaches that could be considered and will venture some comments in another reply. This would be conjecture as I would have to rely on what I have read in the last few weeks.
12 & 13 @ nortie:
Where has the Springboks gone in the last 20 years, Nortie?
It is in the last 20 years, under various coaches, that the Springboks have lost the battle in the win / loss ratio.
So, continue to think what you will, the overall facts speak for themselves. Your hatred for Heyneke Meyer is clouding your judgment and deferring you from seeing the bigger picture.
The last 20 years alone tells me the story that there are deeper rooted issues which need to be addressed too, apart from replacing one coach after the other.
@ grootblousmile:
Thank you Grootblousmile and you have raised some valid points and we are in agreement that are broader problems that need to be resolved and that it wouldn’t necessarily be resolved by just changing the coach. The two actions need to implemented concurrently so that you give the new coach as much time as possible to work with a new crop of players that will go to the next RWC. Bear in mind that there are likely to be about 10 players that would retire before the next RWC and of the 21 remaining players there would only be 7 black players. As I understand the Transformation Charter that would apply going forward, the coach would have to groom, at least, another 8 or 9 black players that would become part of the Springbok training squad.
I think we would have to include a NZ coach in the next coaching panel and it needs to be a combination with some South African coaches. The names that come to mind are:
1) John Plumtree 2) John Mitchell 3) Johan Ackerman and Swys de Bruyn after what they have achieved with the Lions and the understand the faster more inclusive game plan. Then there is Gert Small and I would like to see Pieter De Villiers (ex France player) remaining part of the coaching team. Having a combination of experienced coaches would make sense. I have ruled Mallett out as he has consistently said he is not interested in coaching.
The requirements for the job would be to bring in a team of technically competent coaches that have had international experience; that can motivate players and take them to the next level. The coaching staff would have to teach the Springboks a new and additional skill set and bring more thinking skills on how to handle different situations on the field.
I trust that this is a start on which the debate can ge advanced.
Helgaard
14 @ Helgaard:
You are most welcome, rugby brother… call me GBS or Rudi if you want on the blogs here… everybody knows exactly who I am and I’m not shy for people to know that.
I am actually quite excited about the new Phase that South African Rugby is entering into now, with all the new Super Rugby coaches and Assistant coaches… same applies to Robert du Preez entering as Assistant coach at your Sharks from 2016.
Now SARU must just come to the party and fix things while they have this valuable window of opportunity to do so.
I am all for progression in SA rugby, I am not a conservative thinker at all, my whole day – every day, is spent creating solutions to problems for clients, that’s what I do… and if I was SARU I’d grab onto the start of 2016 with open arms and change the whole landscape.
I do not think Oregan Hoskins, Jurie Roux and the gatgabbas at SARU are capable enough though to do so successfully, and that is so bloody unfortunate for South Africa and rugby in SA.
If successfully changing the problems in South African Rugby includes firing Heyneke, I will be one of the biggest cheerleaders for it… but like I said, I have this inherrent difficulty in finding a suitable replacement for him RIGHT NOW. I have my ideas about who I’d like to be groomed as a logical replacement and they include Matthew Proudfoot and / or John Plumtree and / or Johan Ackermann.
I see John Plumtree as a “South African”, due to his involvement at the Sharks for so many years as well as the fact that he is married to a saffa lady.
I see Johan Ackerman as about 2 years shy of having enough experience, same maybe with Matthew Proudfoot.
Plum could be ready already, but he’s now been out in the world again, so he’s maybe 1 season away from being ready to take over.
None of the other SA Super Rugby coaches are ready to take over, apart from Eddie Jones, and as I indicated, I do not want a foreign coach for the Bokke.
Gert Smal could work right now, as could Nick Mallett, but I doubt either one of them would want to take the position.
grootblousmile wrote:
Yes, I dislike the man as a coach and believe he failed in his 4 years at the helm.
Your aduration for him also clouds your judgement.
You were the fiercest critic of Jake White (still are) and Pieter de Villiers and even Fran’s Ludeke these last few years.
Then it was fine to have at a go at those coaches because you were in agreement.
With Meyer, all of a sudden, it’s different, just because you like him.
You direct your “hatred” towards SARU instead.
Bear in mind, these same brainless morons running SA rugby who you dislike, are the brainless morons who appointed Meyer and are even willing to give him 4 more years. You should be grateful that they are brainless otherwise they might actually appoint a coach who isn’t stuck in 2007.
18 @ nortie:
It’s ADORATION Nortie… and no I do not adore him.
I really liked it when he was appointed… I backed him hard, I thought he would lead the Springboks slowly but surely into the new era, but like you and everybody else I do not and did not agree with everything he did and still does from time to time.
I think most of us thought his appointment at the end of 2011 / beginning of 2012 was a good one, even if it was 4 years late in happening at the time.
I clearly see where he is fallable and where his trouble spots lie.
I think he is too conservative, I think he has problems with team selections, I think he is overly loyal to certain players.
That has been my stance all along in 2015. I criticized him having this facination with Jean de Villiers, selecting Ruan Pienaar, not selecting Jaco Kriel and Elton Jantjies, to name a few.
I think if there was a logical successor to replace him I would be happy to have it happen.
I still am against Jake White, he is only interested in 1 person and that is himself. I think Peter de Villiers (Snorrie) lacks common intelligence and I do not generally get along with unintelligent people.
I still think Frans Ludeke is a great person.. I really like the man, but always questioned his selections in the last few years as well as his inability to change tack and I am glad he has been replaced as Vodacom Bulls Super Rugby coach.
I don’t know how you can seriously contend that I’m against SARU because I like Heyneke Meyer… talk about grabbing for straws there.
I’ve always been critical of SARU – in Jake’s time, in Snorrie’s time and in Heyneke Meyer’s time. You can go read wherever you like and you’ll see that. In fact, I’ll take it a step further, I got involved in an organization in 2007 (was a founding member even before conception), called SARSU (South African Rugby Supporters Union) to try and gain a stake for SA Rugby Supporters in SA in the running of rugby… and to try and steer SARU in the right direction. That Organization did not survive, due to general Supporter apathy in South Africa, as unfortunately a huge lot of supporters are happy to be mere consumers in stead of stakeholders.
Ask Pietman about SARSU, when you get the chance, please do.
So, you are sooooo clearly wrong on so many counts, it’s actually quite laughable.
You’re vindictive and sour, but it’s OK… it’s your right to be that way.
@ grootblousmile:
There’s the rub…you lash out and have a dig at anybody that doesn’t agree with your fascination about Meyer.
That includes the ex Boks.
You write long soliloquies ( is that spelt right? ) about why you firstly don’t think Meyer is supposedly the right man, then follow it up with a long list of other reasons that is the cause of his failings.
I too have a list of why he should go.
1) he coached us to a loss against Argentina
2) he coached us to a loss against Japan
The end
It’s ok for you to have a dig at the coaches and/or ex players and bloggers you feel don’t agree with your outlook.
You even made a snide remark against Pieter Rossouw the other day and how you perceive his “fall from grace” to coach a school team. Have you sat down with him and maybe asked him if that is what he wants to do now? Back at home after years away and perhaps more than happy to give back to a school?
Have another go at me, I might have misspelt another word or two, who knows?
20 @ nortie:
Your bitterness and bile astounds me, Nortie.
jeez you guys, suck on a throat lozenge will you. You’re not THAT far apart in your thinking. And difference of opinion is cool. After all that is why we spend so much time on here(arguing/debating our thoughts) and that’s what makes life interesting. Imagine if we all agreed on everything. How boring is that?
Nice stuff Helgaard. Enjoyed that one as others did I see.
@ nortie: Why shouldn’t he Nortie? He puts it out there. We disagree. If we choose to. Don’t see the issue with that mate.
23 @ Tassies:
Hello Tasse,
Long time no speak.
yebo GB. Busy time of the year. Knackered usually by this time of the day. Hopefully you’ve removed your kevlar vest. I’m chilled for a ‘deebate’ about whatever.
A month and a few days before I get to take some much earned leave. Damn but ’15 has been a tough year to negotiate in the trenches. Got the old cruiser purring like a cat and ready to take on the Weskus once again. No wimmen no cry. Interpret that to mean ‘nyet nagging’. Boys around a fire talking &%$# sipping on fine wine to wash down the kreef and black mussels. Veggies? What’s that?
25 @ Tassies:
Fark Tasse, I do not need a vestie, whether it be kevlar or not!
So what has been happening on Tasse Hill?
speaking of a change of coach. The cupboard is bare. That’s the problem with the lingering debate about the “Meyer must fall” campaign. It’s all very well supporting the cry for change of coach. But to who? One argument I’ve heard is : “anyone but….”. But that’s hardly constructive. I think SARU have a problem here.
26 @ Tassies:
I’ve got a bit of time away planned for middle to end January, unfortunately the wife’s busy season is in December, apart from the fact that all the Vaalies will relocate to the coast in December, so I do not want to follow them in December.
Fok, it’s hot here in Gauteng and we now have water restictions!
I can’t even swim, because I’ve emptied our pool to have reparations done on a few leaks and to redo the fibreglass gell coating!
28 @ Tassies:
Jeeez, that’s what I’ve been trying to get accross… in my soliloquies… hahaha
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