Is Heyneke Meyer putting too many “old eggs” in one basket?
Springboks coach Heyneke Meyer continues his “Dad’s Army” approach by recalling veteran flanker Juan Smith for a training camp ahead of next month’s Rugby Championship.
French club Toulon confirmed three of their South African signings – Smith, lock Bakkies Botha and wing Bryan Habana – would be involved in the Boks camp.
Smith, 32, hasn’t played for the Boks since 2010 as Achilles injuries requiring four surgeries ravaged his career, eventually forcing him to “retire” early last year.
But he made a remarkable comeback in France last September, signing with Toulon and helping them to win the Heineken Cup. A happy Toulon management recently extended Smith’s contract through to 2016.
Meyer admitted earlier this year he was tracking Smith’s form and fitness with interest, believing the former Cheetah’s player hadn’t lost any of his class and that his body was young in mileage terms because of the amount of time he had spent on the sidelines.
Now it seemed Smith might be a contender to feature for the Boks again and even press for another World Cup after winning the 2007 title under Jake White.
Meyer has had no hesitation in looking to experienced players to bolster his squad and also to offshore stars given the leniency of the South African selection policy.
Botha, 34, has confirmed the current European season will be his last, but also expressed his desire to be involved in next year’s World Cup in England.
Like Botha, Matfield was a long-time ally of Meyer from his coaching days at the Bulls.
Matfield completed a remarkable milestone earlier this year when he became the most capped (113) and oldest (37 years and 48 days) Springboks player when he captained the Boks in the second test of their series win against Wales.
The 31-year-old Schalk Burger was another veteran back in favour after missing the last two years with injury and illness.
He should get Joe van Niekerk into the mix as well.
Definitely two sides to this argument.
Important to South Africans is that we win now, it is a bunch of toss for people to say we should experiment more and accept a loss or two. What I have noticed is that there is both a short term and long term plan at the springboks. Some players have shown their mettle while others were mixed or very few poor players.
Johan Goosen (21)
Frans Malherbe (23)
Jaco Taute (23)
Arno Botha (22)
Raymond Rhule (21)
Willie le Roux (24)
Jan Serfontein (21)
PS du Toit (21)
Lood de Jager (21)
Handre Pollard (20)
Siya Kolisi (23)
Marcel van der Mere (23)
Marcell Coetzee (23)
Eben Etsebeth (22)
Oupa Mohoje (23)
Stephan Lewies (22)
Piet van Zyl (24)
Trevor Nyakane (25)
Marnits Boshoff (25)
JJ Engelbrecht (25)
Pat Lambie (23)
Then there is guys like
Damien de Allende (22)
Scarra Ntubeni (23)
Kitchoff (22)
Thomas du Toit (19)
Paul Willemse (21)
Seabelo Senatla (21)
Tera Mtembu (23)
Sburo Sithole (24)
and loads more in the wings, it is great if we have senior experienced players to help these guys into it, because hopefully Meyer will get another 4 years where the Boks will simply dominate the world for 4 years building to a world cup 2019 win.
1 @ Pietman:
Joe never wore the Barberton Daisy……………………………..
Paul Jordaan (22)
Jesse Kriel (20)
Imagine our team for 2019… just from players involved with the boks these last two years
Willie le Roux
JJ Engelbreght
Sburu Sithole
Serfontein/de Allende
Rhule
Lambie/Pollard
Piet an zyl
Arno Botha
Oupa/Kolisi/PSDT
Marcel Coetzee
Eben/Lewies
Lood/PSDT
Malherbe/Nyakane
Strauss (even at 32) / Scarra
Coenie (29)/Marcel
All at about 29 years old and under
Good things coming guys!
@ Scrumdown:
Did Ruan Pienaar and Francois Louw?
5 @ MacroBull:
No. Pienaar is a mystery. I don’t know why HM keeps on picking him.
Louw is a typical HM type player in terms of build and playing style.
Of course both of these 2 players have 1 thing in common, and that’s a family history of association at the highest level in SA Rugby. Conspiracy heory?
No one can tell me big Joe was a k@k player. If he was / is, how did he amass 50 SA Caps?
Truth is, HM likes a certain type of player and playing style.
He has e FIFO attitude, and it doesn’t mean First In First Out!
4 @ MacroBull:
Agree that there are some exceptional talents there. Just VERY thin at Tight Head IMO.
@ Scrumdown:
how much Rugby has big joe played the last two years though? I don’t think anything would justify him being selected by anyone?
Juan Smith was also never a blue Bull.
@ Scrumdown:
we are thin at tight head, scrum half and future hookers. But the perception that that”all the eggs are in one bakery” is the wrong one. People make a big fuss about these older players coming back, but there is a bigger picture.
gosh bakery = basket
hahaha
te vroeg
MacroBull wrote:
Joe helped Toulon win the championship in 2013.
Unfortunately he retired recently, Achilles’ heel has been hampering throughout his career, and finally put an end to it. So, Joe is out of it, anyway….
Pity PdeV didn’t rate Joe at the peak of his career, he deprived us of the opportunity of seeing one of our great Springbok eigthmen in action. He is mentioned in the same vein as the likes of Johnny Wilkinson by those rugby crazies in Toulon, the man is a hero….unfortunately never to be honoured as such in his own country. And it it is all WP and PdeV’s fault
WP should have held on to him…
Joe van Niekerk
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Joe van Niekerk
Full name Johann van Niekerk
Date of birth 14 May 1980 (age 34)
Place of birth Port Elizabeth, South Africa
Height 1.93 m (6 ft 4 in)
Weight 108 kg
Rugby union career
Playing career
Position Flanker/No.8
Professional / senior clubs
Years Club / team Caps (points)
2008– Toulon
Provincial/State sides
Years Club / team Caps (points)
2004–07 Western Province
Super Rugby
Years Club / team Caps (points)
2002–03
2004–07 Lions
Stormers
National team(s)
Years Club / team Caps (points)
2001–2010 South Africa 52 (50)
Johann “Joe” van Niekerk (born 14 May 1980 in Port Elizabeth) is a South African rugby union player, who generally plays either as a flanker or number 8. He currently plays for Toulon in the Top 14.
After starring for the South Africa Schools, under-19, and under-21 sides, and captaining at all three levels, Van Niekerk received the rare honour of being called up to the Springboks directly from the U21 side in 2001, in spite of never having played a game in either the Currie Cup or Super 12.[1] He made his debut against the All Blacks in Cape Town.
Van Niekerk has experienced injury troubles throughout his senior-level career. When healthy, however, he is considered able to compete with virtually any back-row player in the world. He scored important tries for the Boks in home wins over the Wallabies in the 2002 Tri Nations Series and the 2004 Tri Nations Series. He has often been used as an “impact player” off the bench, especially in the 2005 Tri Nations Series.
In 2002, he was voted the South African “Player of the Year”. In the first match of the 2008 Tri Nations Series against the All Blacks in Wellington, he was a surprise choice to start at No. 8. He was expected to play for the Northampton Saints however his contract was terminated before he arrived, reportedly because of constant injury problems. At the moment he plays for RC Toulon, a club in France. In May 2013 he played as a replacement as Toulon won the 2013 Heineken Cup Final by 16–15 against Clermont Auvergne.[2]
Teams
South African Schools 1997–98
South Africa U19 1998
South Africa U21 2000/2001
South African Sevens 2001
Gauteng Lions U21 1998–2001
Gauteng Lions 2001–03
Lions Super 12 Team 2002–03
Stormers Super Rugby Team 2004–07
Western Province 2004–07
Springboks 2001–
Northampton Saints (contract was terminated before arrival)
Toulon (France) 2008 – present
Honours
Toulon
Heineken Cup European Champions: 2013, 2014
Top 14 French League : 2014
What a boykie!!!!
12 @ Pietman:
I always think of him as your “traditional” type 8th man, (if there is such a thing) in the mould of the likes of Johan Claason, Jannie Breedt, and even Morne du Plessis.
Not the biggest and heaviest ball carrier, but certainly a more “athletic” type player who was always there “corner flagging” on defence and a REAL option at the back of the line-out.
MacroBull wrote:
Has he ever played a test under HM? I honestly don’t know.
IMHO his unavailabilty at RWC 2011 was one of the major factors for the SA failure to proceed past the Wallabies.
MacroBull wrote:
Bwahahaha. Talk of a Freudian slip.
In the basket, the eggs still have a chance. In the bakery the best chance the eggs have is of being cracked and used in a pie!
Scrumdown wrote:
Puma here? Claasen!
14 @ Scrumdown:
Its just ridiculous to still be assuming their Meyer only looks at players with the “barberton daisy” on their chest. Bakkies, Vic, FDP were all springbok legends and danie rossouw would also have made a comeback if he could.
Ruan was selected to be a kicking scrumhalf he is for ulster and his versatility is an advantage… The scary thing is just that there hasnt been a consistently good scrumhalf in South Africa since Vermaak left. So Meyer probably sees better advantage than picjing a new scrumhalf every series?
15 @ Scrumdown:I read that after my post while talking to a colleague and bust out laughing haha
one can only speculate why Meyer persists with pienaar lol
17 @ MacroBull:
I agree. However, when he gets painted into a corner it seems that the Barbeton Daisy is his default option.
A case in point, his call up of Callie Visagie and Marcel vd Merwe recently despite them clearly not being the best options in terms of the stat’s for SR.
It may not have been important in the context of the series, but it did, (and appears to be) his default option at times.
I have no problem with who he picks. It’s his right as SA’s head coach. I just don’t aleways agree with his choices.
@ Scrumdown:
I think we talked about this last time? Callie must be about the seventh choice hooker if not lower when everyelse is fit. Marcel is going to be a super star and he still has 2 more possible world cups in him. I don’t think many questioned his inclusion.
Scrumdown wrote:
Come back Puma. all is forgiven.
I need someone with “dikker vingers” than me on the site.
20 @ MacroBull:
Do you rate Marcel that highly?
Can’t say I’ve really given hm much scrutiny.
I’ve always been of the opinion that in a front row forward technique will always trump brawn.
That’s why I am genuinely and happily surprised at the performance of the Lions’ “lightweight” front rowers in the past SR competition.
Ackermann (or Balie Swart?) must be doing something VERY right.
@ Scrumdown:
I rate marcel over his general play more than anything. Hopefully he will come morr to the forefront next year and get more gametime.
The lions props are all young and while it is generally accepted the lions scrummed well its hard to recall their names really ever standing out at any stage? While their scrum technique has been great I can’t recall the lions props being very imposing elsewhere?
Redelinghuys played for the world xv on the bench.
Scrumdown wrote:
Maybe Wynand Claassen, from Bulls/Sharks, 1981 Bok Capt.?
Johann Claasen was that big old dominees lock from Potchefstroom.
@ MacroBull:
Imposing in what way?
You have a Bok front row playing for the Sharks who is seen on the field for all the wrong reasons…arguing with referees, copping yellow cards etc.
I would prefer the props to do their primary work in the scrums and not get involved in side shows, like the Lion’s props this year, but that’s just me
Shark’s team announced, thread up and running…Lambie at 10 as expected
Pietman wrote:
Maybe even that one!!!!!!!!!!
@ Scrumdown:
No SA number 8 of late even come close to Gary Teichman, imho.
Pietman wrote:
WOT?????
Not even Bobby (Fore)Skinstad?
@ Scrumdown:
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