Wales (9) 12 / 26 (6) Pumas (Final Score)
Wales and the Argentinian Pumas did battle in the End Of Year Tours at Millennium Stadium, Cardiff at 16:30 SA Time.
This was the live match discussion Article.
The match was broadcast LIVE on SuperSport 1, SHD & CSN on TV in SA.
*******************
Scorers:
Wales:
- Penalties – Leigh Halfpenny (4)
- Drop Goals – 0
- Tries – 0
- Conversions – 0
Pumas:
- Penalties – Felipe Contepomi (1), Nicolas Sanchez (1)
- Drop Goals – Nicolas Sanchez (2)
- Tries – Juan Imhoff (1), Gonzalo Camacho (1)
- Conversions – Nicolas Sanchez (2)
Teams:
Wales: 15 Leigh Halfpenny, 14 Alex Cuthbert, 13 Scott Williams, 12 Jamie Roberts, 11 George North, 10 Rhys Priestland, 9 Tavis Knoyle, 8 Toby Faletau, 7 Sam Warburton (Captain), 6 Josh Turnbull, 5 Ian Evans, 4 Alun-Wyn Jones, 3 Aaron Jarvis, 2 Matthew Rees, 1 Gethin Jenkins
Replacements: 16 Richard Hibbard, 17 Ryan Bevington, 18 Paul James, 19 Rob McCusker, 20 Justin Tipuric, 21 Mike Phillips, 22 James Hook, 23 Liam Williams.
Argentina: 15 Juan Martin Hernandez, 14 Gonzalo Camacho, 13 Gonzalo Tiesi, 12 Felipe Contepomi, 11 Juan Jose Imhoff, 10 Nicolas Sanchez, 9 Martin Landajo, 8 Juan Martin Fernandez Lobbe (Captain), 7 Juan Manuel Leguizamon, 6 Leonardo Senatore, 5 Julio Farias Cabello, 4 Manuel Carizza, 3 Juan Figallo, 2 Eusebio Guinazu, 1 Marcos Ayerza.
Replacements: 16 Agustin Creevy, 17 Bruno Postiglioni, 18 Juan Gomez, 19 Tomas Vallejos, 20 Tomas Leonardi, 21 Nicolas Vergallo, 22 Horacio Agulla, 23 Joaquin Tuculet.
Date: Saturday 10 November
Venue: Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
Kick-off: 16:30 SA Time (14:30 GMT)
Expected weather: The roof will be closed, which negates the expected showers. High of 10°C and a low of 5°C
Referee: Romain Poite (France)
Assistant referees: George Clancy (Ireland), Dudley Phillips (Ireland)
TMO: Jim Yuille (Scotland)
Will be interesting to see how Pumas go after there first RC with the big three this year.
Jeez wich they change that name. Why not just the 4 Nations? Or if that name has been used, why not ‘SH 4 Nations’ as RC does sound a bit daft.
Anyhow go Pumas. Need to be supporting our sh teams now.
wich = which
@ Puma:
wrong again. wich = wish….lol.
Here is a article from the IrishTimes.com
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Springboks won’t give an inch as Ireland search for redemption
GERRY THORNLEY, Rugby Correspondent
RUGBY: Ireland v South Africa To hell with the IRB rankings, World Cup draws, the presence of Lions coach Warren Gatland and other such trivialities for the moment. Come the welcome 5.30pm kick-off under lights and what should be a feverish Aviva given the forecast of a dry evening, this Ireland coaching ticket and team alike need a performance to restore confidence in themselves and their public.
Admittedly, in such a time of need, there could have been handier visitors than a match-hardened Springboks; no one’s idea of a team inclined to give an inch. And as circumstances would have it, Ireland also look a tad under-nourished as well as under-cooked.
It’s been five long months since Ireland reeled away from Hamilton, and only seven of that Ireland starting team survive, what with losing two Lions captains and two European players of the year as well as a player, Stephen Ferris, who is the prototype for this kind of confrontation.
The Hamilton wounds linger, as if all else has been airbrushed from history, including nearly beating the All Blacks a week beforehand. Imagine the perception if that had been a two-Test tour? Ireland’s true standing is probably closer to the first of those two wild extremes, though while this refreshed team ought also to be fresher physically and mentally, one of the worries is it took them a game to re-acquaint themselves with the intensity generated by the Southern Hemisphere big three, as is usually the case for the European teams in this or any other Test window.
Then again, these more structured Springboks are not as unpredictable as the All Blacks. Given the choice of going through you or round you, they take the former route.
Ruan Pienaar is liable to box kick defensive lineouts, restarts and much else from their own territory. Further up the field they launch Jean de Villiers or one of the backrow carriers up the middle and then bludgeon with one-off runners before going wide. When closer still to the opposition line, they go to their maul and failing that, turn to one-off runners or De Villiers before picking their time to go wide.
Much of their back play has looked lateral and unthreatening save for the absent Bryan Habana, but the fit again JP Pietersen had a fine Super campaign and the selection of the talented Patrick Lambie is a curve ball. He is more naturally inclined to attack the gain line than Morné Steyn, and he has a more inventive array of short kicks. Along with backrow, outhalf looks a critical duel, with Ireland more proven in the latter, if less potent in the former.
Lambie’s place-kicking, given the Boks’ unusual woes in this regard, is a primary reason for his selection, though it may also suggest Heyneke Meyer does feel under pressure to apply more width. Zane Kirchner’s first instinct is to kick and their booming kick-chase not only applies pressure but cleverly closes the space to prevent quick throws.
A tad ominously, with last June in mind, their restart and lineout games are excellent, while their scrum and pack are settled. Eben Etzebeth competes brilliantly on the opposition throw and along with a typically muscular backrow, midfield et al, will be unremittingly confrontational.
Their tacklers will need to be encouraged to release, and their quickness in manoeuvring themselves over the ball, notably Francois Louw and Duane Vermeulen, is sure to test Ireland’s continuity.
So, as Les Kiss acknowledged yesterday, while it’s one thing knowing what the Boks might do, it’s another thing stopping them. Ireland’s accuracy will be tested everywhere, especially in their basics, and this includes restarts.
In the absence of Seán O’Brien and Ferris, and now all the more so with the loss of Paul O’Connell, it really is a day for new heroes; the likes of Cian Healy and Richardt Strauss, Mike McCarthy in the secondrow and Peter O’Mahony, whose switch to blindside ought to ensure more carries.
You sense there’s a big performance coming from Ireland, that they will draw a line in the sand early on to match the Boks physically and at the breakdown.
But, ultimately, Ireland are going to have to outsmart rather than outmuscle the Boks.
Clearly, with the selection of Simon Zebo’s big left boot, along with his running attributes, Ireland will seek to avoid playing too much rugby in their own half.
But it will be by selectively going wide and using the footwork and pace of Keith Earls, along with the ballast and strength of the outside three, that they might find chinks in South Africa’s armour out wide.
Though more battle-hardened, this South African side have achieved little north of Namibia to date, drawing in Argentina and losing to Australia and New Zealand. Ireland have a real shot, it’s just that South Africa are more acquainted with the high intensity this game is liable to be played at, and Ireland are just that little less equipped to cope than they would have been with O’Connell, Ferris and O’Brien in their ranks.
HOW THEY LINE OUT
South Africa
Zane Kirchner (Bulls)
J P Pietersen (Sharks)
J acoTaute (Lions)
J ean de Villiers (W Province, c),
Francois Hougaard (Bulls)
Pat Lambie (Sharks)
Ruan Pienaar (Ulster)
Tendai Mtawarira (Sharks)
Adriaan Strauss (Cheetahs)
J annie du Plessis (Sharks)
Eben Etzebeth (W Province)
Juandre Kruger (Bulls)
Francois Louw (Bath)
Willem Alberts (Sharks)
Duane Vermeulen (W Province)
Replacements : S Brits (Saracens), C J van der Linde (Lions), P Cilliers (Lions), F van der Merwe (Bulls), M Coetzee (Sharks), M Steyn (Bulls), J de Jongh (W Province), L Mvovo (Sharks.)
Ireland
(Munster) Simon Zebo
(Ulster) Tommy Bowe
(Munster) Keith Earls
(Leinster) Gordon D’Arcy
(Ulster) Andrew Trimble
(Leinster) Jonathan Sexton
(Munster) Conor Murray
(Leinster) Cian Healy
(Leinster) Richardt Strauss
(Leinster) Mike Ross
(Connacht) Mike McCarthy
(Munster) Donnacha Ryan
(Munster) Peter O’Mahony
(Ulster) Chris Henry
(Leinster, c) Jamie Heaslip
Replacements : S Cronin (Leinster), D Kilcoyne (Munster), M Bent (Leinster), D O’Callaghan (Munster), I Henderson (Ulster), E Reddan (Leinster), R O’Gara (Munster), F McFadden (Leinster)
Referee: Wayne Barnes (England).
Forecast : South Africa to win.
So they without some of their best and so are our Boks.
We don’t have these players that were in the RC. We did only have Bissie for a short while in the first test, but he is a massive loss.
Bissie
Fransie
Habs
Goosen
Some others that have been injured all year. Or with overseas teams.
Schalk
Juan Smith – Though with Burger we should see him with the Boks again, not sure if Juan Smith, he has been away for too long now. Legend though.
Bakkies
Steenkamp
Brussow
J. Fourie
So we too are missing some big names.
See they still have us to win, well I think they are right, if we don’t win this then we have to seriously think about our game plan because think that will be the only thing that my stop us. These players are all too good to lose to Ireland today.
Still would have had Juan de Jong starting. Pity.
Anyhow. Go Bokke just do it!
Have said this before. Going to be interesting to see how we go with the new 5 sec rule. Pienaar gonna have to be on top of his game.
Another excellent read from the IrishTimes.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Modern game has proved a leveller for South Africa
In this section »
South Africa
Ireland
Springbok intimidation
GAVIN CUMMISKEY
AUTUMN INTERNATIONALS: South Africa used to be able to bully their way to victory. But not anymore
”We’re looking forward to going to Ireland in November,” said Springbok captain Gary Teichman after the second Test against Ireland in 1998 at Loftus Versfeld. “So are we,” came Keith Wood’s immediate response.
Ireland may have lost that game 33-0 but they refused to be intimidated. That was the minimum requirement because to accept bullying from South Africa is to guarantee a horrendous and relentless beating. That’s why we love the Springboks – they happily embrace the bad guy role. Young Eben Etzebeth was bewildered this week when only tentatively labelled an “enforcer”.
“In South Africa if you play with the number four on your back it is your role. I know the responsibility of that,” he said.
Looking at the respective forwards who collided back in 1998 it is easy to understand how a constant stream of running battles occurred. “Just one big brawl,” was how Ireland’s number eight that day, Victor Costello, remembers it.
The Boks’ infamous hooker James Dalton was japing away and throwing digs, while monstrous flanker Andre Venter only ever knew how to dominate. Even the greatest scrumhalf of that generation, Joost van der Westhuizen, was up to no good, kicking a grounded Mal O’Kelly. That’s what sparked the ensuing madness. Van der Westhuizen was only yellow-carded.
Paddy Johns, a man who led Ireland with such honesty through the dark years and being cut from a long line of uncompromising Ulster locks, made the decision to fight back. Wood was the obvious and repeat target, mainly because he constantly insisted on carrying into contact.
All hell broke loose when Trevor Brennan arrived on 53 minutes. Not long after, Peter Clohessy followed the Barnhall Bruiser into the fray.
“There were incidents everywhere we went on that tour on and off the pitch,” said Costello. “Including the crowd. They try and intimidate you. You go down to Bloemfontein or Pretoria and the supporters would be banging on our bus and calling you names. It was always going to drift on to the pitch.
“We weren’t the most skilful team, we hadn’t got any consistency of performance that year but we were not going to take it off them anymore. Paddy Johns had enough and, yeah, it became a brawl. Now, were we able to adapt from brawl to performance? No. Were they? Absolutely. But we were going to stand up to them.”
Famed predecessors
It can be taken as a certainty that today’s young Springbok pack will be bursting to live up the reputation of their famed predecessors. “It won’t be like ’98,” Costello continued. “South Africa have grown up a bit, if you like. Bullying is not everything anymore. My problem is I can’t remember an international of note that Ireland have won without Brian O’Driscoll in the past 10 years.”
When it comes to Irishmen beating South Africa, Fergus Slattery is second only to Willie John McBride, who by default of the Lions captaincy is the first among equals from the unbeaten 1974 team.
Everyone in rugby has heard of the infamous “99 call” in the third Test when McBride, like Johns after him, had enough of the isolated assaults on his players. Slattery describes it better than most because the flanker was in the middle of it when JPR Williams flung himself at Moaner van Heerden.
“For the first Test in Cape Town we met a largely Western Province team but then we went to Pretoria for the second Test and they got rid of half the guys and brought in what I call Voortrekkers, Afrikaners, and that didn’t work either . So then, for the third Test in Port Elizabeth, they brought in the gorillas. Plan A and Plan B didn’t work so Plan C was to try and beat us up. We knew it was going to be really physical so we just had to match it. And that’s what we did .”
Some moments in sport can take on mythical status but the “99 call” irks Slattery to this day. “Personally, I think it is greatly exaggerated. The principle of the third Test was they were going to physically have a go at us. And they did but they just weren’t strong enough. It just didn’t work.
“A couple of sides had a go at us. The same thing happened in New Zealand in ’71 in Hawkes Bay. They just tried to kick us out of the park.
“You can’t do that today. You have to remember the game we played and the game these guys are playing now, while not totally different, they are worlds apart. One of the problems we had was if you got the shit kicked out of you – and guys got reefed with studs and really opened up – nothing happened.
“In ’74 in South Africa there was no television. There was no citing. If the referee didn’t pick it up that was it.
“The great advantage players have today is they can go down on the ground with the ball and won’t get the head kicked off them. The injuries you get today are natural injuries!”
Game evolves
We want to steer Slattery back to the point of the article but he found a rhythm and when one of the rugby’s great players is talking about the game, you listen. “The game evolves and it will always evolve. The extraordinary thing about the modern game is how it has evolved.
“In the 1930s it was “first up, first down” – whoever got to the breakdown went in and secured the ball. Whereas in our generation and the generation after us if you were a back, it was a case of “you are a ballet dancer, get out of here!” They ran straight back out into their position. Now, again, it is whoever gets there first, the Brian O’Driscolls of this world, they go in and fight the corner.”
Slattery actually sees the modern game as a leveller, in that the natural Springbok power is not as influential. “If you go back in time the average South African was bigger than his European counterpart. He was probably an inch taller and certainly a stone heavier. And that particularly was the case with the forwards.
“When you are bigger and stronger, like the Afrikaners, who are people from the outback and a lot of them went into farming, they used their physicality because they had it. That became their mentality as well.
“The whole trick about playing against the South Africans was not to let them do that.
“The modern game has somewhat neutralised the South Africans traditional game because all professional players are equal in the sense that they have similar routines of diets and gym work. They all take supplements, they are now all big and strong. People just caught up with South Africa.
“They were never as good technically as they were physically. I would say their scrummaging was sometimes only okay. New Zealand’s strength was in their rucking. The whole principle of New Zealand rugby was once the ball got into a ruck situation they just remove anything in the way out of the way.
“No matter what it was, human beings or whatever, they just got raked out. They just went after the ball. New Zealand played as a machine brilliantly. All eight forwards did it. That was the hallmark of New Zealand rugby.
Left behind
“With the South Africans the physicality was everything. They were ranked number one or number two in the world for 50 or 60 years. I think they have slipped a bit from that position. Australia have closed that gap. If you don’t change with the game you get left behind.”
Costello agrees in the sense he believes Ireland can match their physicality. “They still play to their strength, which is the Afrikaner strength. You can’t get that in the gym. They will try to dominate but Ireland can cope with it.”
It’s enjoyable talking to retired internationals in the lead up to these November matches. They, like the rest of us, have been starved of genuine beautifully brutal rugby for several months. Sure, the Heineken Cup in October whets the appetite but it is the sight of Springboks striding out at Lansdowne Road that boils the blood on a freezing November day.
“Don’t expect the Springboks to come out like Ragball Rovers because they got their “16 injuries” either,” Costello warns. “They can all slot into a very clear pattern of play. That’s where Ireland have gone wrong. Leinster, Munster and Ulster have a way to play rugby but when they go to Ireland they stop playing the way they know because everyone wants to put a stamp on it.
“The way the South Africans play rugby is similar right through their whole country. That’s why you can have players over in France coming in for a week and slotting in. It is a simple brand of rugby – slow, controlled and very much strength organised. They are an arrogant bunch of men. They think they are the best at everything. That comes from the crowd and manifests itself on the pitch.
“Their coach comes over here and has talked about an entirely new Springbok pack but they have a default setting and that is, we are better than everybody. They have absolutely no respect for us,” he continues, with the memories of Dalton punches fresh in the mind.
“Their winger (JP Pietersen) forgetting who he was marking is an example. In modern rugby you do so much analysis of the opposition or maybe you don’t if you are South African, you see what I am saying?
“ That’s the way they are.”
Sorry gbs, I am messing up the Wales/Pumas thread here. Put up the Bok/Ireland thread I can post these articles there.
Actually some of that article gets my blood pressure up a bit……LOL.
So they think we are a arrogant bunch of men….LOL. And we think we are the best at everything………LOL. It comes from our crowd they say and it manifests on the pitch??? LOL. Okay having a laugh now. This must fire up the team surely?
Go Bokke!
BEAST out of the test today.
Damn that is bad news. Hope he is okay.
This from Sports24
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Mtawarira blow for Boks
2012-11-10 14:04
Cape Town – Springbok prop Tendai “Beast” Mtawarira has been withdrawn from the Test against Ireland due to heart palpitations.
Kick-off is at 19:30.
Really hope it is nothing sersious with Beast.
Big blow for us. Think Cilliers will take his place. So who will be the extra prop on the bench then? We don’t have another to make up a full front row now.
Could just be the start of flu as that could do that as well. Truly hope nothing serious with Beast.
Wonder if we will get another prop from the players playing overseas. We don’t have another prop for the bench to make up the full front row requirement. Pity Steenkamp is also out injured. Actually we will HAVE to get a prop from of the the saffas playing in nh by the game tonight. Jeez this is a big blow now. We only have Chili in the squad left and he is a hooker. Pity about Majuti as he can cover TH with CJ covering LH. Just as well CJ plays both sides of the scrum. Wonder how this will go if we can’t get another prop?
Saru send a SOS to whoever this side to get Mujati cleared to play for us today. Dammit why the damn fuss, he has played for the Boks before, has lived in his country for more than 3 years. Sure he is living and playing overseas now, but come on he has played for the Boks. This is a urgency now, who knows they may be able to pull strings and get Mujati.
10 @ Puma:
Hello Puma, ag no man thats not good news for the Boks
13 @ Puma:
If I’m not mistaken did they not put Heinke vd Merwe ‘on standby’ or even actually add him to the squad? A pity no Beast but at least Heinke is based in Ireland so should be able to answer an SOS
16 @ Bullscot:
Well it will be Heinke then. He will have to slot straight in onto the bench. With no training with the squad. Eish! hope it is okay.
They do have still a open space for a player, don’t think they filled in player 32 yet. So if Beast can’t carry on further in this tour they will have to bring in another prop to cover ourselves, that is with Van der Merwe as well. Jeez why take so many wings and leave out the extra prop? Especially when we know we have to have a full front row on the bench at all times. Need a extra prop in the squad just in case he is needed.
Though I hope Beast is okay next week. Big loss I think. Also remember the number of poc that have to start. Truly hate to mention that as it is degrading for players to hear that to be honest. However, all the players on this tour are on merit and they know that and that is important for their self esteem.
Eishhhh… not good that Beast is out!
Yip you right BS think Van der Merwe even on stand by is player 32. However, if Beast has to return home they will need to get another prop in the squad.
19 @ Puma:
Really hope that its not too serious for Beast with his heart palpitations they will have to manage him carefully, I guess the team doctor will have it all tested and work out how serious it is but don’t think its wise to do that level of physical exertion with any hint of heart trouble so as you say Beast may well be on his way home. All the best Beast.
19 @ Puma:
I did mention on this site when it was announced that Bakkies and Wentzel were on standy by that is was good from a practial point of view to have these players who are close by and link up with the squad at very short notice on standby. This vindicates this policy from the Boks, because if they didn’t have Heinke there how on earth would they have been able to get another prop in all the way from South Africa at such short notice.
See Sports24 say it is CJ to start and Heinke on the bench. So that is all sorted. Though CJ is NO Beast. What a pity Beast is out. Hope he is okay for next week.
It was toungue in cheek but not too long ago mentioned that we could rope John Smit in to help out at prop for the Boks… there’s your man Puma
Doubt it would happen though, remember WP Nel is in Edinburgh so may be an option now to be drafted into squad for next week, he has been there for all of the northern hemisphere now so shouldn’t be out of the reckoning, the Boks haven’t seemed to be keen to pick players who have just started out with their overseas clubs ala Kankowski and CJ Stander but as WP has been here for a while why not call him up, unless he has made himself unavailable to Boks so he can try qualify for Scotland… but I’ve not read anything like this from him. Also Jacobie Adriaanse has very recently joined up with Scarlets (I think) in Wales so he could be an option although that would go against the ‘policy’ this year.
21 @ Bullscot:
For sure you are right there, but let this be a lesson to the selectors and to cover ourselves with more props than wings! We have 5 wings on tour, that is daft, should be a extra prop as we now HAVE to always have a full front row on the bench.
23 @ Bullscot:
Well if Beast has to come home I then expect to see Nel to be with the Boks next week when we in Scotland. Though I read somewhere he wanted to play for Scotland? So he may not be too happy to help out. We also could by next week have sorted out Mujati’s citizenship…. 🙂 Saru could send a SOS to whoever to get it sorted you never know it could happen.
25 @ Puma:
Practically it would make sense to call up WP Nel but as you say too we not sure if he is ‘available’, there is only one way to find out and thats for the SA management to give him a phone call.
Ah no Puma you didn’t take the bait on my suggestion of John Smit as an option
Puma what are your thoughts on the abilities of Jacobie Adriaanse? This is the verdict from walesonline :
“The 27 year-old prop from MTN Lions is highly regarded as a technical scrummager and effective ball carrier with strong defensive skills”
Scarlets coach Simon Easterby also sings Jacobie’s praises :
New Scarlets head coach Simon Easterby said: “This is an important signing for us and we’re really pleased Jacobie is joining us both in terms of his technical ability and to broaden our strength in this area of our squad.
“We know that he’ll have a positive impact for us going forward adding real strength to our pack this season.
“Securing someone of his ability and track-record is in line with our philosophy to carefully research, manage and target the right players to bring into our set-up.
“We want to add to and enhance the talent and experience we have here and
bring players to the Scarlets shirt that fit with our ambitions over the next two to three years.
“These players need to contribute not only in terms of performance and our focused targets for our three competitions this season and next, but also to the wider development of our squad – particularly our next generation players.
“Jacobie’s arrival ensures we have powerful options at tight head and also enables us to properly manage the development of Rhodri Jones and Samson Lee, making sure we don’t over commit two of the most promising forward prospects in Welsh rugby at a critical stage in their development.
“We are working closely with the WRU to ensure the players we recruit contribute to the development of Welsh rugby as a whole.
“They need to be fully committed to our values as a rugby region and have real ambitions to achieve within Welsh rugby and our three competitions – the Heineken Cup, RaboDirect PRO12 and LV=Cup.”
26 @ Bullscot:
No problems if we got Smit, he is actaully very good at looshead. Another thing JC Van Rensburg was excellent for Lions, but I think the selectors went with CJ and Cilliers as they both can scrum on both sides of the scrum. Right now it is handy as we can still have one on the bench to cover th. Van Rensburg’s scrumming as excellent during the CC. Also thinking they would have known how many other saffas in nh that could just fill in if needed. Just that CJ is NO Beast, so hope he goes okay. We will miss Beast for this game I think.
OK…
I have now copied and configured some new Software..
I have built, rendered and saved a Video Project for Handbriekie’s MBA studies…
My drink is charged, the swimmingpool is beautifully blue and sparkling clean…
Time for some rugga, for goodness sakes!
Users Online
Total 363 users including 0 member, 363 guests, 0 bot online
Most users ever online were 3735, on 31 August 2022 @ 6:23 pm
No Counter as from 31 October 2009: 41,823,547 Page Impressions
_