Yesterday, me and Morne had a little discussion regarding Wynand Olivier and his alleged position as the No. 1 inside centre in South Africa.
Now, to go on a rant and write 30 paragraphs of opinionated nonsense would only spark debate and arguments and bring us nothing nearer to an informed decision. So I decided to go the other route, the statistical route, and I downloaded the statistics of the 5 most prominent inside centres in South Africa for the first 5 rounds of Super Rugby.
Olivier for the Bulls, De Jongh for the Stormers, Bosman for the Cheetahs, Le Grange for the Lions and because the Sharks were somewhat inconsistent with selection (which might be a reason behind their failures) I chose Riaan Swanepoel, who played the last 3 games for the Sharks, as he had the most exposure, Jacobs had two games at 12 and Strauss only one.
I thought I knew what I was going to find, but I was wrong, the statistics paints a very interesting picture:
Basically I will let the stats speak for themselves, Juan de Jongh coming out top in 3 of the 5 categories, and Wynand not in one. Let’s debate this brothers, because I am 100% sure, that none of us expected this.
After a quick glance, Doppies seems to be the top 12?!
Now see what a winning team would do for him!
Swaan really disappointing….hopefull we’ll get Jean DeV.
what these stats actually say is that Le Grange should be the incumbent 12, not so?
same old same old……….hehehee
No guys, check his defense stats, they are absolutely appalling…
What you should be asking yourself is, what has he done with the heaps of possession thrust upon him?
A centre is much more than merely a distributor.
Stats are a wonderful thing, but clearly not the begin all and end all…
A line break for each player can be awarded but the one could have been far superior and resulted in say a match winning try.
At the end I know who I would choose in my team when I have the choice of Doppies and Meisiekind..
Same goes for all the rest.
So in short,stats can be used as a guideline but are no clear cut indication…
Let the arguing continue…
I for one are very happy with our 12….
#5 Ja nee, ek is ook…..sal beslis nie vir Doppies bo WO kies nie, de jong is goed maar moet nog bietjie ondervinding kry, dink hy gaan nog ‘n great speler word…..maar nou ja jy kry mense wat net nog nooit van WO gehou het nie en nooit sal nie…….
For now ‘Chip ‘n Dales’ will sadly have to do, but Juan is closing the gap rapidly.
So Doppies sux on defense, but useful on attack. I however think he’s probably one of the only two top players left in the Lions side.
Blouste…Meisiekind is playing fantastic rugby when in Blue BUT seems to have played badly in green and gold on the few opportuinities that he got. Why do you think that is. I like meisiekind but I haven’t seen him play that well in a Bok jersey yet.
Saint,
Thanks for the research, but I think what we can learn from this exercise is that “a man (or woman) reads what he wants to read and disregards the rest”.My apologies to Paul Simon.
Maybe you should’ve included a summary comment…
5 – Blouste, You would be happy with him. Olivier playing really fantastic rugby for the Bulls.
Sharks need to seriously look for a new inside centre. We miss Frans Steyn there this year huge.
Meyer Bosman, enough said.
ThePaint,
Look at the Lions defense as a whole, it’s absolutely rubbish.
Give a man like Doppies a chance at playing for a ‘real’ top side and he’ll surely shine. (just please not another Lion for the Sharks, we’ve got enough now)
#11 Loosehead
Ja, looks like that swelling he picked up on his left cheek has also subsided somewhat, hehe!
@8 pokkel – In my opinion, the difference is that WO had an extended rub in Blue, but was never allowed to settle in Green and Gold.
He had a couple of tests but mainly out of position, at wing,outside centre etc etc.
Never have he had the change to play in his preferred position for an extended run like Adi Jacobs had for instance…
Hi Fender, lousy weather today.
fender
I have been made to look biased because of some of my recent comments, so I decided, I will not add any of my own opinion to the above piece, and merely let the figures do the talking.
Personally I am not a fan of Wynand Olivier, and was appaled to see him in the team of the week every week, even though he has not been the best centre on show. Opinion is offtimes formed because of the environment that the player plays in, the Bulls are playing up a storm, so their players look better, but that is not necessarily the case.
Wynand is made out as a hard working centre, but stats clearly show that all three the other franchises (Sharks excluded) has centres putting in more work.
So, obviously, WO inclusion is basically a “I like you, or I don’t like you” call.
he he he….rub = run…
14 – Blouste, Spot on. If Olivier had a extended run at inside centre for the Boks it would look very different for him there. You need plenty game time with teams to play really well.
I really don’t see JdV getting that position back at all. He must have lost a lot of pace playing rugby up north. For the Tri-Nations it has to be Olivier there for the Boks. Otherwise something not fair going on.
#16 Saint,
Nah, you weren’t made to look biased – you did that all by yourself, broer. 😉
But look, we agree; ultimately people are going to believe what they wanna in spite of the stats. And objectivity is clearly under-appreciated.
But that’s kool too..
Puma
I’m afraid Olivier won’t be first choice…
P de V have his favourites…
But time will tell I suppose…
#15 Loosehead
Ja, seems that the season isn’t waiting for Easter before it changes like it normally does. Rain predicted for the rest of the week.
Talking about Easter: am I going to catch you at Bloemendal’s Champagne and Oyster festival on Sat 3 and Sunday 4 April?
There is a little three piece that will be taking the stage on Sunday that you might recognise….
#19
Jeez, being unbiased is difficult, usually 90% of all people saying they are unbiased, usually isn’t, I guess I have to add myself to the 90.
I thought going the accountant’s way, without emotion would be the right call, but you can’t extract emotion from rugby, otherwise it’s just another game.
#22
Can’t argue with that, Saint. And anyway, objectivity is like HD – not everyone’s set is HD compatible..
20 – Blouste, You see that is not right, I will never agree to that. The best must be selected and always. Shame for the players that put in the hard graft week in and week out and produce the goods. They should get selected.
Agggggggggggggggg???? It probably wont happen. Then I never ever thought I would see Frans Steyn get the FB position last year and he did. He probably never thought he would get his own position in the team either, probably a big factor for going overseas to play his rugby. Then he got chosen for the Boks to play FB. Too late, as he had signed with the French club by then. Well he only got a chance cause of a injury to another player. So maybe he too would not have got a chance. Did read it was John that persuaded PdV to select Frans at FB and Brussow when Burger was injured. So let us see what happens this year. Hoping no stupid selections but on merit only. Not sure if it will happen though.
Well when i watch rugby Mesiekind is the one that impresses me, he always seems all over the field tackleing players and stopping them, and when he gets the ball he shows no fear or hesitation and runs with gusts and gusto. He looks very effective to me.
Some one said once that stats dont mean much and seems they were right, oh and it was a person that knows there rugby cant remember who.
#25
As said previously, easy to look good in a team that is not struggling.
Helllllloooooooooooo Puma, just a qick greeting before i have to get busy again, was glad to read you were missing me :-). Have been so busy and then to exhausted later, but have been following on my cell, hopefully will be posting again soon when things calm down.
21 – Fender, For what it worth we have overcast weather up here in Joburg today but I am loving it 😆 We get too much sun up here.
#24
What do you think of the way that Schalk has come back to fight for his jersey? WIth the new law interpretations, would you have chosen Brussouw over Burger (current form obviously)?
Different gameplans from different unions can also influence these stats…
The Bulls in their last game for example seemed to use WO as a bashing ram more than anything else…
So all these have to be taken in account when the analyses are being done imo…
Users Online
Total 270 users including 0 member, 270 guests, 0 bot online
Most users ever online were 3735, on 31 August 2022 @ 6:23 pm
No Counter as from 31 October 2009: 41,824,641 Page Impressions
_